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Thread: Fireforming a 30BR

  1. #46
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    May 2010
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    Drummondville, QC, Canada
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    results in fireforming from 6BR Lapua Brass to 30BR directly in 30BR chamber

    I thought I would post results of my fireforming experiment. Measured chamber length and trimmed back new Lapua 6BR brass enought to avoid brass neck dammage to chamber when fireforming. Loaded 10gr. Unique + COW + topping the case with lead bullet lub. Fired them and results were perfectly concentric expanded neck 30BR brass. Ran Forster .308" inside neck reamer with Forster hand trimmer (so .308" outside neck turner pilot would fit in), then outside neck trimmed down to .010" using Hornady neck trimmer. Sized Necks with Custom Lee Collet Sizer I had made by Lee with 2 fired brass. Loaded 118gr. FBHP bullets on top of H4198. Accuracy is amazing. I have yet to find the bullet seating sweet spot and should be ready for competition as soon as these Covid19 restrictions are lifted. I won't be using Expander dies anymore. I noticed brass sometimes doesn't come out straight and even after 10-15 firings doesn't straighten out. Fireforming 6BR directly to 30BR is, to me , the way to go. I respect if some guys prefer expanding with expanding dies but don't have to agree.
    Appreciate everyone's input on this topic.
    Dan
    Last edited by danyboy; 05-19-2021 at 04:10 PM.

  2. #47
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    Dec 2003
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    Quote Originally Posted by danyboy View Post
    ......I noticed brass sometimes doesn't come out straight and even after 10-15 firings doesn't straighten out. .........
    You've noticed something very important. That you get ONE (1) chance, ONE (1) shot, pardon the pun to make straight cases from the soft, malleable brass. Upon being hammered the brass work hardens, it's physics. Once it's work hardened you can no longer make it conform. (Unless you're qualified and willing to anneal back to factory spec).

    "You can't straighten a bent wire"

  3. #48
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    Feb 2003
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    Houston, Texas
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    Quote Originally Posted by danyboy View Post
    I thought I would post results of my fireforming experiment. Measured chamber length and trimmed back new Lapua 6BR brass enought to avoid brass neck dammage to chamber when fireforming. Loaded 10gr. Unique + COW + topping the case with lead bullet lub. Fired them and results were perfectly concentric expanded neck 30BR brass. Ran Forster .308" inside neck reamer with Forster hand trimmer (so .308" outside neck turner pilot would fit in), then outside neck trimmed down to .010" using Hornady neck trimmer. Sized Necks with Custom Lee Collet Sizer I had made by Lee with 2 fired brass. Loaded 118gr. FBHP bullets on top of H4198. Accuracy is amazing. I have yet to find the bullet seating sweet spot and should be ready for competition as soon as these Covid19 restrictions are lifted. I won't be using Expander dies anymore. I noticed brass sometimes doesn't come out straight and even after 10-15 firings doesn't straighten out. Fireforming 6BR directly to 30BR is, to me , the way to go. I respect if some guys prefer expanding with expanding dies but don't have to agree.
    Appreciate everyone's input on this topic.
    Dan
    My method is similar.....Only I use a regular 6BR barrel with the neck remed out to .330. When I fire full house 6BR round in this barrel, out comes a perfectly formed non neck turned 30BR case.

    One thing about this method. The case retains much of the original 1.560 length of the Lapua 6BR. So, I had a reamer ground to a trim to length of 1.545.

    It is on file at Pacific Tool as the 30 BR Schmidt.

  4. #49
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    Feb 2006
    Location
    Wilcox, PA
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    Cool

    [QUOTE TRY PLAY DOUGH.
    =danyboy;844367]I thought I would post results of my fireforming experiment. Measured chamber length and trimmed back new Lapua 6BR brass enought to avoid brass neck dammage to chamber when fireforming. Loaded 10gr. Unique + COW + topping the case with lead bullet lub. Fired them and results were perfectly concentric expanded neck 30BR brass. Ran Forster .308" inside neck reamer with Forster hand trimmer (so .308" outside neck turner pilot would fit in), then outside neck trimmed down to .010" using Hornady neck trimmer. Sized Necks with Custom Lee Collet Sizer I had made by Lee with 2 fired brass. Loaded 118gr. FBHP bullets on top of H4198. Accuracy is amazing. I have yet to find the bullet seating sweet spot and should be ready for competition as soon as these Covid19 restrictions are lifted. I won't be using Expander dies anymore. I noticed brass sometimes doesn't come out straight and even after 10-15 firings doesn't straighten out. Fireforming 6BR directly to 30BR is, to me , the way to go. I respect if some guys prefer expanding with expanding dies but don't have to agree.
    Appreciate everyone's input on this topic.
    Dan[/QUOTE]

  5. #50
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Drummondville, QC, Canada
    Posts
    50

    Hard bolt lift now

    Spent time reading about hard bolt lift on this forum. Something new to me came up : ring dies . With my 6 BR and itís Custom made Lee Collet Die, I never experienced hard bolt lifts till about after using brass 25 times. With Custom made Lee Collet 30 BR Die, totally different story. After 3 shots, bolt is getting harder to lift, even chambers harder much faster than with 6 BR.
    These ring dies make a lot of sens as they seem to size the base of the brass and supposedly solve this hard bolt lift issue.
    Question is where can one get these ring dies ?

  6. #51
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
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    608
    try base sizing with a 308 win small base die.
    if that works look for a sizing die that is the same or close at the base

  7. #52
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    dannyboy: A carbide 45ACP die can work well for touching up the base. -Al

  8. #53
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    Cool Straighten a bent wire.

    Quote Originally Posted by alinwa View Post
    you've noticed something very important. That you get one (1) chance, one (1) shot, pardon the pun to make straight cases from the soft, malleable brass. Upon being hammered the brass work hardens, it's physics. Once it's work hardened you can no longer make it conform. (unless you're qualified and willing to anneal back to factory spec).

    "you can't straighten a bent wire"
    for many yrs my dad straighten bailing wire with a fence strecher after he fed a bale a hay to cows.

  9. #54
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    608
    seems a little short in the as issued state.
    Quote Originally Posted by Al Nyhus View Post
    dannyboy: A carbide 45ACP die can work well for touching up the base. -Al

  10. #55
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    May 2010
    Location
    Drummondville, QC, Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al Nyhus View Post
    dannyboy: A carbide 45ACP die can work well for touching up the base. -Al
    Good idea, got one, tried it out never worked. Fired case base is .470, 45 ACP die is .4762. Too big.
    Thanks anyway.
    Last edited by danyboy; 06-28-2021 at 08:47 AM.

  11. #56
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    Feb 2003
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    Lower Dakota Territory
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsmithsr View Post
    seems a little short in the as issued state.
    No, it's not.

    You might want to read Danny's reply, though......

  12. #57
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    Feb 2003
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsmithsr View Post
    seems a little short in the as issued state.

    Chuckle chuckle mike.

  13. #58
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    Feb 2003
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    Lower Dakota Territory
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    Quote Originally Posted by danyboy View Post
    Good idea, got one, tried it out and works perfect. Thanks
    Glad it worked for you, sir.

    Honestly, though....if you're getting hard bolt lift after just a couple of firings on a 30BR, my suggestion is to look at the back end of the chamber or get a die that's bit more aggressive on sizing the back end. I've seen a couple instances where the diameter of the body/shoulder junction was to blame. That's a bit unusual with the BR case but not completely unheard of. Most don't look there for the issue, though.

    A good way to check this is to take a case that's giving you a sticky bolt and stress relieve the case at the body/shoulder area (ie: 'anneal' though that's not really what we're doing ). Then size it normally including using the 45 ACP die for the base. Now fire it and see how many firings it takes to get 'sticky', using your normal sizing set up w/o using the 45ACP die on the base. If it gets 'sticky' after the same amount of firings as before....you know it's the base giving you gas. If you can go more firings before it gets 'sticky', you know the front end is in play, as well.

    Having a big back end on these chambers is never a bad thing, though.

    For what it's worth.... Al

  14. #59
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    May 2010
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    Drummondville, QC, Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al Nyhus View Post
    No, it's not.

    You might want to read Danny's reply, though......
    Will never work. 45 acp is .4762, fired 30BR case base is .470. Perfect size would be 8 x 75 rimmed or 9 x 63 or 9.3 x 74R or 9.5 x57 Mannlicher Schoenaver which all are .4685. Got none of them but working on it.
    Last edited by danyboy; 06-22-2021 at 08:26 AM.

  15. #60
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Drummondville, QC, Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al Nyhus View Post
    Glad it worked for you, sir.

    Honestly, though....if you're getting hard bolt lift after just a couple of firings on a 30BR, my suggestion is to look at the back end of the chamber or get a die that's bit more aggressive on sizing the back end. I've seen a couple instances where the diameter of the body/shoulder junction was to blame. That's a bit unusual with the BR case but not completely unheard of. Most don't look there for the issue, though.

    A good way to check this is to take a case that's giving you a sticky bolt and stress relieve the case at the body/shoulder area (ie: 'anneal' though that's not really what we're doing ). Then size it normally including using the 45 ACP die for the base. Now fire it and see how many firings it takes to get 'sticky', using your normal sizing set up w/o using the 45ACP die on the base. If it gets 'sticky' after the same amount of firings as before....you know it's the base giving you gas. If you can go more firings before it gets 'sticky', you know the front end is in play, as well.

    Having a big back end on these chambers is never a bad thing, though.

    For what it's worth.... Al
    Al,
    Iím using a custom made Lee Collet Die and a Redding Body Die(only every 3-4 firings for the Body Die).

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