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Thread: Fireforming a 30BR

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Iowa
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    97
    Danyboy

    With all the variations in chamber reamers!

    I will make myself a case length plug if want to know the actual length the reamer cut or if someone altered the original chamber that was cut!

    I will trim a piece of brass short then full length size case and insert the plug. Seat the plug long then put in rifle and close the bolt it will push the plug into case. Open bolt remove case and measure overall length. I trim my brass .010 short of that measurement.

    My 30BR .330 neck plug is brass with a .330 dia cut square on one end and .3085 bullet dia on the other end. If you know someone with a lathe they can make you one.

    Not all chamber reamer drawings match the actual chamber reamer dimensions.

    Have fun with your 30BR!
    Russ
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    Last edited by R Stiner; 04-22-2021 at 10:33 PM.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    563
    sinclair sells the insert

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    563
    i think this may be an indicator of the problem.
    none of my lapua 6br brass has .020 thick necks.
    typically around .012 or so.

    Quote Originally Posted by danyboy View Post
    tIf I fireform without thinning necks to .010, they won't even fit over the neck trimmer shaft cause Lapua 6BR neck is .020" thick.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Poetry, Tex.
    Posts
    6,865
    Quote Originally Posted by rsmithsr View Post
    i think this may be an indicator of the problem.
    none of my lapua 6br brass has .020 thick necks.
    typically around .012 or so.
    Just measured several 6br Lapua brass. Mine average .013-.0136. It doesn't matter if you fireform without a bullet first. I do not want to neck turn until I do one fireform operation.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Drummondville, QC, Canada
    Posts
    42

    finally got my chamber length

    Quote Originally Posted by R Stiner View Post
    Danyboy

    With all the variations in chamber reamers!

    I will make myself a case length plug if want to know the actual length the reamer cut or if someone altered the original chamber that was cut!

    I will trim a piece of brass short then full length size case and insert the plug. Seat the plug long then put in rifle and close the bolt it will push the plug into case. Open bolt remove case and measure overall length. I trim my brass .010 short of that measurement.

    My 30BR .330 neck plug is brass with a .330 dia cut square on one end and .3085 bullet dia on the other end. If you know someone with a lathe they can make you one.

    Not all chamber reamer drawings match the actual chamber reamer dimensions.

    Have fun with your 30BR!
    Russ
    Russ,
    When you say 'Have fun with your 30BR', I sure have some just learning this bras forming stuff. I measured the chamber length: 1.525", which corresponds to one of the 3 reamer prints Dave Kiff sent me.
    I donít have access to a lathe nor do I know anyone who has one. I used the method described here:

    http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...-length-gauge/

    Thanks for taking time to show me how to measure the chamber length.
    Dan
    Last edited by danyboy; 04-24-2021 at 04:59 AM.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    696
    Quote Originally Posted by R Stiner View Post
    Danyboy

    With all the variations in chamber reamers!

    I will make myself a case length plug if want to know the actual length the reamer cut or if someone altered the original chamber that was cut!

    I will trim a piece of brass short then full length size case and insert the plug. Seat the plug long then put in rifle and close the bolt it will push the plug into case. Open bolt remove case and measure overall length. I trim my brass .010 short of that measurement.

    My 30BR .330 neck plug is brass with a .330 dia cut square on one end and .3085 bullet dia on the other end. If you know someone with a lathe they can make you one.

    Not all chamber reamer drawings match the actual chamber reamer dimensions.

    Have fun with your 30BR!
    Russ
    This post ought to have a "sticky" - Thank You, Russ!!
    Keep in mind, the addage, "there's more than one way to skin a cat"! This is a good one - ya just gatta remember, that most reamers feature a 45 Deg. angle at the mouth, thus, the large [plug] diameter should be very close to, and only, "ever so slightly", smaller than the chamber neck-diameter. RG

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    ME
    Posts
    1,843

    That is so very true!

    Quote Originally Posted by R Stiner View Post
    Danyboy

    With all the variations in chamber reamers!

    I will make myself a case length plug if want to know the actual length the reamer cut or if someone altered the original chamber that was cut!

    I will trim a piece of brass short then full length size case and insert the plug. Seat the plug long then put in rifle and close the bolt it will push the plug into case. Open bolt remove case and measure overall length. I trim my brass .010 short of that measurement.

    My 30BR .330 neck plug is brass with a .330 dia cut square on one end and .3085 bullet dia on the other end. If you know someone with a lathe they can make you one.

    Not all chamber reamer drawings match the actual chamber reamer dimensions.

    Have fun with your 30BR!
    Russ
    Woe be the shooter that gets a reamer that cuts a too small throat, only to be discovered after chambering the barrel! Can't happen? Well yes it can, and I've been there

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Kentucky-Home of the Kentucky Wildcats
    Posts
    2,378
    Quote Originally Posted by glp View Post
    Woe be the shooter that gets a reamer that cuts a too small throat, only to be discovered after chambering the barrel! Can't happen? Well yes it can, and I've been there
    Are you referring to diametrically or length? Anything is possible because humans are involved, but lengthwise, most prints have a + of like .005, minus nothing. Diameter SHOULD be much tighter tolerance than that. Most of my prints show + .0004 and minus nothing, diametrically. This is on the reamer.
    Last edited by mwezell; 04-24-2021 at 09:33 PM.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Lower Dakota Territory
    Posts
    2,139
    Quote Originally Posted by glp View Post
    Woe be the shooter that gets a reamer that cuts a too small throat, only to be discovered after chambering the barrel! Can't happen? Well yes it can, and I've been there
    Greg, that's one of the reasons that the late Stan Ware had his reamers done with no throats. Stan throated in a seperate operation so as to have control over that critical part of the chamber. Done as a seperate operation, throat length could be optimized for the bullet being used. Plus, it allowed experimentation with different throat diameters.

    For the .30's, Stan's collection of throating reamers were .3083, .3084, .3085, .3086, .3087 and .3088 .....measured, not assumed . At different times, we tried all of the diameters in our 30 WareWolfs, 30BR's, 30BRX and 30 WolfPups.

    A chamber length checker plug as Russ Stiner posted is a must have. Randy's observations on the 45 degree angle is spot on.

    Good shootin'. -Al

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Augusta, Maine & Palm Coast, Fl
    Posts
    6,408

    Which Throat

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Nyhus View Post
    Greg, that's one of the reasons that the late Stan Ware had his reamers done with no throats. Stan throated in a seperate operation so as to have control over that critical part of the chamber. Done as a seperate operation, throat length could be optimized for the bullet being used. Plus, it allowed experimentation with different throat diameters.

    For the .30's, Stan's collection of throating reamers were .3083, .3084, .3085, .3086, .3087 and .3088 .....measured, not assumed . At different times, we tried all of the diameters in our 30 WareWolfs, 30BR's, 30BRX and 30 WolfPups.

    A chamber length checker plug as Russ Stiner posted is a must have. Randy's observations on the 45 degree angle is spot on.

    Good shootin'. -Al
    gave the best results?

    Thanks,

    Pete

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    ME
    Posts
    1,843

    Al

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Nyhus View Post
    Greg, that's one of the reasons that the late Stan Ware had his reamers done with no throats. Stan throated in a seperate operation so as to have control over that critical part of the chamber. Done as a seperate operation, throat length could be optimized for the bullet being used. Plus, it allowed experimentation with different throat diameters.

    For the .30's, Stan's collection of throating reamers were .3083, .3084, .3085, .3086, .3087 and .3088 .....measured, not assumed . At different times, we tried all of the diameters in our 30 WareWolfs, 30BR's, 30BRX and 30 WolfPups.

    A chamber length checker plug as Russ Stiner posted is a must have. Randy's observations on the 45 degree angle is spot on.

    Good shootin'. -Al
    That would have saved me a lot of time, grief, aggravation and cost! So much for the maker's, of this 30BR reamer, quality control. No excuse for what he delivered me. Never went back to him.

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Lower Dakota Territory
    Posts
    2,139
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Wass View Post
    Which gave the best results? Thanks, Pete
    Pete, testing the 30BR's at Stan's private range: aka the 'Westbrook Warehouse' during what we called 'Happy Hour'....that hour before sunset when conditions just lay down....we couldn't see any difference at 100 yds. At 200, groups with the .3087's and .3088's were definitely larger.

    We back to backed this quite a few time with multiple Lilja 3 groove 17's, Kreiger 17's, Rock non-5R 17's and at least one Kostyshyn 4 groove 17. Bullets used were my Dakota B1's 117's and 125's (.3083/.3085 p.r.) and BIB 118's. The trend remained constant even as the exact mix of barrels and components changed. Guns used were Stan's HV Panda, my HV Panda, LV Panda and LV RFD actioned 'Red Hammer' guns. We didn't test the HBR guns but did screw the HBR barrels from our HBR Kodiaks on the Pandas and tested them in that way.

    We used 200 yd. at the 'Westbrook Warehouse' to test neck clearance also.

    Good times, lots of work but it payed off. Stan was very meticulous in everything and an excellent tester. Here's a pic of Stan inside the 'Westbrook Warehouse' before we began testing one evening along with a 5 shot group I fired at 200 with my Panda HV gun testing that same evening.




  13. #43
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    696

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Al Nyhus View Post
    Pete, testing the 30BR's at Stan's private range: aka the 'Westbrook Warehouse' during what we called 'Happy Hour'....that hour before sunset when conditions just lay down....we couldn't see any difference at 100 yds. At 200, groups with the .3087's and .3088's were definitely larger.

    We back to backed this quite a few time with multiple Lilja 3 groove 17's, Kreiger 17's, Rock non-5R 17's and at least one Kostyshyn 4 groove 17. Bullets used were my Dakota B1's 117's and 125's (.3083/.3085 p.r.) and BIB 118's. The trend remained constant even as the exact mix of barrels and components changed. Guns used were Stan's HV Panda, my HV Panda, LV Panda and LV RFD actioned 'Red Hammer' guns. We didn't test the HBR guns but did screw the HBR barrels from our HBR Kodiaks on the Pandas and tested them in that way.

    We used 200 yd. at the 'Westbrook Warehouse' to test neck clearance also.

    Good times, lots of work but it payed off. Stan was very meticulous in everything and an excellent tester. Here's a pic of Stan inside the 'Westbrook Warehouse' before we began testing one evening along with a 5 shot group I fired at 200 with my Panda HV gun testing that same evening.




    Thank you, Al! Great pic of Stan.

    For, I cannot recall how long now, but certainly since the wide variety of [so called] 30BR Robinette reamers began appearing (mis-spelled too), I have advised, both via phone conversations(s) and I-net forums, that, for ultimate precision, KNOWING both the actual chamber OAL and neck diameter are imperative. The 30 BR is a "wild-cat" cartridge . . . well, ok, only a domesticat . . . never believe a reamer print. RG

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Augusta, Maine & Palm Coast, Fl
    Posts
    6,408

    Thanks Al

    Good info and great picture of Stan. Thanks for putting it up for us to see. I think of Stan every so often.

    Pete

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