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Thread: Custom Benchrest stock - Tony Boyer

  1. #1
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    Custom Benchrest stock - Tony Boyer

    I'm looking for a pic of a benchrest stock used by Tony Boyer.

    When Tony was shooting rimfire he used this particular stock. He may have also used it for his centerfire rifles.

    I'm sure it was custom made and I think it was carbon fiber. It was very low profile and looked quite different from most benchrest stocks.

    If anyone recalls this stock and has a pic please post.

    Thanks,

    TKH (4628)

  2. #2
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    I seem to recall it being a Bob Scoville carbon stock.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by tim View Post
    I seem to recall it being a Bob Scoville carbon stock.
    Tim,

    Do you have any photos of the Scoville stock?

    I know Scoville made some carbon fiber stocks but I don't recall the styles.

    As you know the Pippin stock format has became the most popular in RFBR but the stock Boyer used was quite different.

    I recently experienced the low profile stock design by Jerry Stiller and being made by ROTEX. I liked it much more than I expected.

    Now I'm curious about the stock Boyer was using. I never had the opportunity to try it but now it has my interest.

    Someone, somewhere, has Tony's old rimfire rifle with that stock but I haven't seen it around anywhere.

    I don't know if that stock was a one off or more were produced. I'm on a search to find out.

    Any help would be appreciated.

    TKH (4628)

  4. #4
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonykharper View Post
    Tim,

    Do you have any photos of the Scoville stock?

    I know Scoville made some carbon fiber stocks but I don't recall the styles.

    As you know the Pippin stock format has became the most popular in RFBR but the stock Boyer used was quite different.

    I recently experienced the low profile stock design by Jerry Stiller and being made by ROTEX. I liked it much more than I expected.

    Now I'm curious about the stock Boyer was using. I never had the opportunity to try it but now it has my interest.

    Someone, somewhere, has Tony's old rimfire rifle with that stock but I haven't seen it around anywhere.

    I don't know if that stock was a one off or more were produced. I'm on a search to find out.

    Any help would be appreciated.

    TKH (4628)
    As far as I know they are virtually all the same….he still makes them although he is now in his 80’s and about done, I have one on a BAT.
    His disciple, Bob Scarborough make them, or made them, but they are about impossible.
    They are quite low profile, and tend to recoil down and back without bounce, I would say other than comfort/style the actual benefit might be negligible.
    The closest in profile, although in laminated cedar would be the ones Tony Larson makes/made. They are quite nice, beautifully made… I had one a few years back.

  6. #6
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    Kelbly makes the KLP which is a fiberglass stock that copies the shape of a Scoville very closely.

    KLP Rifle Stock

    The Scoville is unlike any fiberglass stock though. It is constructed of multiple pieces and densities of balsa wood and wrapped in carbon fiber with some kind of special magic mixed in. I have one on one of my centerfire rifles and it is very smooth and settled in the bags. I don't know how that would translate to the light recoil of a rimfire.

  7. #7
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    Some years ago I got a carbon over balsa laminated stock.
    Was made by Enda, an Irish shooter.
    Very low weight, impressively stiff, low profile, parallel planes, and tracked quite well.

    Sold the action, but not the stock, because it belongs to my shooting milestones...

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	1703015R350 GE Enda.JPG 
Views:	205 
Size:	1.18 MB 
ID:	25494

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry W View Post
    Kelbly makes the KLP which is a fiberglass stock that copies the shape of a Scoville very closely.

    KLP Rifle Stock

    The Scoville is unlike any fiberglass stock though. It is constructed of multiple pieces and densities of balsa wood and wrapped in carbon fiber with some kind of special magic mixed in. I have one on one of my centerfire rifles and it is very smooth and settled in the bags. I don't know how that would translate to the light recoil of a rimfire.
    Thats it, or reasonably close, Tony's was silver, as best as I remember with a Lapua decal on it.. He shot IR matches at Piney Hill several years ago.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by PedroS View Post
    Some years ago I got a carbon over balsa laminated stock.
    Was made by Enda, an Irish shooter.
    Very low weight, impressively stiff, low profile, parallel planes, and tracked quite well.

    Sold the action, but not the stock, because it belongs to my shooting milestones...

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	1703015R350 GE Enda.JPG 
Views:	205 
Size:	1.18 MB 
ID:	25494
    Pedro,

    Thanks for the pic.

    I know you have much experience with the Pippin stocks and with this low profile stock.

    Do you think there is anything to be gained with the low profiles?

    I've just about talked myself into doing a project testing the extreme low profile with the Pippin profile using the same barreled action.

    Please give me your opinion if I'm just wasting my time.

    This is the stock Tony Boyer was using and the design I would like to use.

    I should note that is a two piece stock. The toe piece can be removed and the stock becomes extremely low profile.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Boyer 2.jpg 
Views:	230 
Size:	193.9 KB 
ID:	25495

    TKH (4628)
    Last edited by tonykharper; 05-28-2022 at 09:51 AM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry W View Post
    Kelbly makes the KLP which is a fiberglass stock that copies the shape of a Scoville very closely.

    KLP Rifle Stock

    The Scoville is unlike any fiberglass stock though. It is constructed of multiple pieces and densities of balsa wood and wrapped in carbon fiber with some kind of special magic mixed in. I have one on one of my centerfire rifles and it is very smooth and settled in the bags. I don't know how that would translate to the light recoil of a rimfire.
    Jerry,

    Thanks for the info. I see the KLP stock is one piece. Perhaps cutting it to make it even lower profile would be an option.

    Thanks again.

    TKH (4628)

  11. #11
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    While you didn’t ask FWIW, the two piece butt seems a solution in search of a problem. The molds these days, are so good, these stocks track arrow straight, you cut the butt you are asking for trouble and are likely going to greatly compromise structural integrity. I’d probably seriously consider the Kelbly.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonykharper View Post
    Jerry,

    Thanks for the info. I see the KLP stock is one piece. Perhaps cutting it to make it even lower profile would be an option.

    Thanks again.

    TKH (4628)
    I could be wrong about Tony's, but I believe the purpose of the 2-piece butt is to have interchangeable parts. An angled piece as shown, and a non-angled to convert it into more of a straight line stock.

    Edit to add: Accurate Shooter Article
    Last edited by Jerry W; 05-28-2022 at 08:20 PM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonykharper View Post
    Pedro,

    Thanks for the pic.

    I know you have much experience with the Pippin stocks and with this low profile stock.

    Do you think there is anything to be gained with the low profiles?

    I've just about talked myself into doing a project testing the extreme low profile with the Pippin profile using the same barreled action.

    Please give me your opinion if I'm just wasting my time.

    This is the stock Tony Boyer was using and the design I would like to use.

    I should note that is a two piece stock. The toe piece can be removed and the stock becomes extremely low profile.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Boyer 2.jpg 
Views:	230 
Size:	193.9 KB 
ID:	25495

    TKH (4628)
    Tony,

    Indeed a have a lot of experience with those stocks, but I tend to shoot the lowest possible profile. Pippin and others cannot compete against, at least for my shooting style, with the lower profile ones. As much as I like the Pippin profile they all have been replaced by our (Ricardo and myself) design. A lower profile one, lightly made, but with CF laminations to maintain stiffness.

    They are just more precise, or should I say "forgiving"?...

    Physics don't lie, the closer the GC to the recoil line, the better. You'll have less recoil upwards jump, and much less roll. Less roll will mean less front pads pressure, so better movement flow. This can be explained by vector power directions and lever effect. The higher the stock the more leverage you'll get. That's another reason I preach the least possible weight on top of the action.

    Looking at Boyer's stock picture, I think you can go even lower, not only on butt area, but also at the front. Secret is getting a lower profile, while maintaining the same stiffness. Carbon fibre helps a lot here.

    Finally a warning word using CF... it should be well damped against vibrations. Balsa as core material is great, as well as some polyurethane foam. With foam you should choose density according to desired weight.

    Interesting enough, the harder the wood, the less damping properties. Also, try to avoid wood used for musical instruments, like Spruce, Mahogany, Ziricote and others. If some of these woods are going to be chosen (beauty for exemple) laminate them with cross grained planes.
    Last edited by PedroS; 05-28-2022 at 07:05 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by PedroS View Post
    Tony,

    Indeed a have a lot of experience with those stocks, but I tend to shoot the lowest possible profile. Pippin and others cannot compete against, at least for my shooting style, with the lower profile ones. As much as I like the Pippin profile they all have been replaced by our (Ricardo and myself) design. A lower profile one, lightly made, but with CF laminations to maintain stiffness.

    They are just more precise, or should I say "forgiving"?...

    Physics don't lie, the closer the GC to the recoil line, the better. You'll have less recoil upwards jump, and much less roll. Less roll will mean less front pads pressure, so better movement flow. This can be explained by vector power directions and lever effect. The higher the stock the more leverage you'll get. That's another reason I preach the least possible weight on top of the action.

    Looking at Boyer's stock picture, I think you can go even lower, not only on butt area, but also at the front. Secret is getting a lower profile, while maintaining the same stiffness. Carbon fibre helps a lot here.

    Finally a warning word using CF... it should be well damped against vibrations. Balsa as core material is great, as well as some polyurethane foam. With foam you should choose density according to desired weight.

    Interesting enough, the harder the wood, the less damping properties. Also, try to avoid wood used for musical instruments, like Spruce, Mahogany, Ziricote and others. If some of these woods are going to be chosen (beauty for exemple) laminate them with cross grained planes.
    Pedro,

    Thanks for sharing that information. All the principals you mentioned about keeping the CG low as possible and close to the recoil line makes perfect sense.

    Rifles fired off sandbags that has to be very important.

    I think as RFBR has moved to unlimited games (ARA, PSL, and unlimited IR 50/50) where we use one piece rest, many with solid guides, we have gotten away from those principles.

    As our scopes have become more powerful and heavier. Again, going against the principal of keeping weight above the action to a minimum.

    As Tim has said, perhaps we shouldn't worry about those things as long as our stocks track straight.

    I still think I'm going to spend a little time (money) to compare a low profile against the Pippin style.

    I'm going to do the test using traditional two piece bag set up and a one piece rest.

    My thinking now is if I can see any difference, it will be with the bags but who knows?

    One other factor in this is how the stocks fit the person behind them.

    When I used the Stiller low profile I found it easier to handle and get behind which surprised me since I've used Pippin style stocks for at least 15 years.

    Even if the stocks don't make an accuracy difference it is possible if one doesn't fatigue the shooters as much that in itself could be an advantage.

    Especially on long weekend, two tournament (12 card total) matches.

    Thanks to everyone that has responded and helped me find the Tony Boyer stock.

    TKH (4628)

  15. #15
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    A final though for you.
    You might take a hard look as well at Tom Merediths TMBR Low profile offering. They are considerably lower than the Pippins, at 1.5 lbs. light, and arrow straight….made for him by Kelblys. That, and unless you’re a masochist and like to make pillars and do bedding, he is as good as it gets at that game as well as custom hardware, trigger guard, butt plate, etc. doing this since the 80’s, reasonably priced and gets the stuff out. I have been extremely pleased with the ones I have.

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